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Acquaintance has been guaranteed a pre-reg placement verbally, is this possible?

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  • Acquaintance has been guaranteed a pre-reg placement verbally, is this possible?

    Basically I have this person I know at uni who keeps on (excessively) bragging about how he's one step ahead of everyone else because he managed to "secure a placement" at the pharmacy he managed to get a job at. This was during our 1st year of uni (now 2nd year...with exams coming up arrghhh), during the summer holidays. They basically said that "feel free to come for us for a pre-reg placement" or something along those lines.

    Now from what I'm aware, the system has changed now where all MPharm students must sit this Oriel exam in order to get a placement. So for his scenario, does he not have to sit that exam then because he's already guaranteed a place?

  • #2
    Verbal offer?
    Even if it is in writing then it is not binding.
    Lots can change in two years to this person would be well advised to get more offers.
    Otherwise in two or so years time there will be a posting on here...
    "I was promised a pre-reg place and they have gone back on their word - what can I do?"

    Advice to you... cast your net wide and get as many offers as you can.
    Then pick the best with the best options.

    Is Oriel for NHS placements?
    Not sure about it - I'm sure someone who knows more will chip in.
    47 BC : Julius Cesar : Veni Vidi Vici : I came, I saw I conquered.
    2018 AD : Modern Man : I shopped, I clicked, I collected.
    How times change.

    If you find you have read something that has upset or offended you an anyway please unread it at once.

    Comment


    • #3
      Oriel is only into it's second year now. Community pharmacies were offered the opportunity to sign up but there was no requirement to do so.

      At present I believe there is all the NHS trusts, a significant amount of Boots and a certain number of independents in the system but other pharmacies can still recruit the old fashioned way (and prefer to as they maintain control).

      As Pharmanaut said I'd try applying directly and through Oriel. Don't miss out on potential industry placements as well just because they're not registered.
      I remember when a blog was an individual boot.

      Comment


      • #4
        I wouldn't be surprised, he will know how their shop is run and be free labour. Which means less time training someone who has never step foot in a pharmacy before - win win for the pharmacy, by your friend should consider doing their pre reg elsewhere to gain more varied experience.

        Comment


        • #5
          Agree with points above by others.

          Plus:

          1) Not your problem/concern so go ahead and concentrate on your exams! :-) Good luck!

          2) I'm not a lawyer but as far as I'm aware...oral contracts can be enforceable according to UK law but it isn't easy to prove, so ALWAYS get something in writing. ALWAYS. (Note: I imagine a job offer doesn't necessarily constitute a contractual agreement unless specific terms of employment were discussed and generally require third party substantiation/corroboration to help with proof). And realistically, there's no way you'd ever try and enforce a job offer as way too many ways for them to make your life a complete misery, so it really is a moot point.

          3) Oriel is optional. If you score a place independently so be it (and I also very much encourage it). We're not a part of the Oriel process but I've heard around that some pharmacies are not responding to students' enquiries following placements so it may be that the pharmacy (or either party) can walk away if they want. (ask the faculty admin in charge what the story is).

          4) A hundred leftfield events could take place in the years (or months) between getting an oral offer of a placement and the time it comes to sign the contract. The pharmacy could be sold, go under (the cuts are biting most independents), or unfortunate tragedies such as owners or managers either moving on or passing away unexpectedly, leaving the student with zilch as TUPE law covers existing employees. For instance, how many pre-reg places do you think there'll be if the government cut the funding for it? Nursing course applications have dropped significantly since the government removed the bursaries for nurses, which paid for their uni fees. Suddenly it'll be a choice between paying more wages for a student who you have to put a lot of effort and time into teaching (for them only to leave in a year) or spending less on a dispenser who'd possibly stay with you indefinitely.

          Food for thought...now get back to cramming!

          Good luck.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Locum X View Post
            Agree with points above by others.

            Plus:

            1) Not your problem/concern so go ahead and concentrate on your exams! :-) Good luck!

            2) I'm not a lawyer but as far as I'm aware...oral contracts can be enforceable according to UK law but it isn't easy to prove, so ALWAYS get something in writing. ALWAYS. (Note: I imagine a job offer doesn't necessarily constitute a contractual agreement unless specific terms of employment were discussed and generally require third party substantiation/corroboration to help with proof). And realistically, there's no way you'd ever try and enforce a job offer as way too many ways for them to make your life a complete misery, so it really is a moot point.

            3) Oriel is optional. If you score a place independently so be it (and I also very much encourage it). We're not a part of the Oriel process but I've heard around that some pharmacies are not responding to students' enquiries following placements so it may be that the pharmacy (or either party) can walk away if they want. (ask the faculty admin in charge what the story is).

            4) A hundred leftfield events could take place in the years (or months) between getting an oral offer of a placement and the time it comes to sign the contract. The pharmacy could be sold, go under (the cuts are biting most independents), or unfortunate tragedies such as owners or managers either moving on or passing away unexpectedly, leaving the student with zilch as TUPE law covers existing employees. For instance, how many pre-reg places do you think there'll be if the government cut the funding for it? Nursing course applications have dropped significantly since the government removed the bursaries for nurses, which paid for their uni fees. Suddenly it'll be a choice between paying more wages for a student who you have to put a lot of effort and time into teaching (for them only to leave in a year) or spending less on a dispenser who'd possibly stay with you indefinitely.

            Food for thought...now get back to cramming!

            Good luck.
            Plus
            5. There’s always one clever dick and they’ve been known to come unstuck!

            And all the best with the exams from me, too.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Merlyn View Post

              Plus
              5. There’s always one clever dick and they’ve been known to come unstuck!

              And all the best with the exams from me, too.
              Never too early to get the letters out to everyone - including industry etc etc.
              Remember also what will set you out from other students with the same quals?
              Get some additional skills once you have finished the exams.
              Find out what makes people tick and how to get the most out of them .... including yourself.

              https://www.businessballs.com/

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AAQT6ifGys

              "Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans"
              (Attributed to John Lennon)
              47 BC : Julius Cesar : Veni Vidi Vici : I came, I saw I conquered.
              2018 AD : Modern Man : I shopped, I clicked, I collected.
              How times change.

              If you find you have read something that has upset or offended you an anyway please unread it at once.

              Comment


              • #8
                This did happen a lot, especially in Scotland when they started the PRPS scheme for the first time. A lot of employers reassured their existing pharmacy students that they'd get a placement. We were told there was some kind of "ranking system" where the ones on top would have the best chance of securing a place - rubbish. If you had no prior experience (or didn't know the right people) were left with virtually nil chance of a placement. I had to hunt for a pre-reg place round the midlands because of this.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hey guys, late on the update. Luckily I have managed to pass my exams (I was literally screaming on the day) but unluckily that guy I had mentioned still is going on about it annoyingly. Anyway, I guess I just have to put up with him for 2 more years.

                  Comment


                  • admin
                    admin commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Well done on passing your exams

                • #10
                  I now realise I was lucky. At age 16, as soon as i knew I was destined for pharmacy, I applied to the area manager for the shoe and got a Saturday job on the counter. The senior assistant (a Mr Catchpole who had a small office in the cellar) became my immediate boss and I learnt the OTC side and how to operate the till etc.
                  After passing A levels, I then became the branch apprentice under the dispenser who would regale me with stories of his time in various army hospitals. All the time while at Uni I worked as a Saturday boy and for a time after qualifying, acting as a relief.
                  National service was beckoning, but I decided that £11/week teaching was better than £8 in the army and managed to locum during the school holidays. I worked most Saturdays in the East End where I learnt about life in the slums. Looked on Google earth and all gone now. In those days, boys dream was to work in the docks. Cable street ran alongside the shop in Watney street which looked just like the East Enders set. I worked for the owners in various premises for over 30 years and still exchange cards with their daughter who was five when I started.
                  johnep

                  Comment


                  • kjkim
                    kjkim commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Hi Johnep, I would like to request if you do not post on my future questions or any posts on this website. Being completely honest I do find you quite arrogant and inconsiderate - I still remember when you posted on a question long ago when I was inquiring about doing pharmacy despite having achondroplasia. Your answer was very dismissive, ignorant, whereas everyone around me (giving me false hopes or not) was very supportive, and to be honest, I have done several summer placements where the pharmacist was only just taller than me or even the same height.

                    Please have a look at your reply on this exact post....you're literally just stating what you've done in the past, and haven't in any way tried to link it to my post. I am not usually this straightfoward or blunt, thanks for reading.

                • #11
                  I just wrote to an independent in my area, had a quick interview and was offered a pre-reg place.
                  Lively debate is encouraged but please respect the opinions and feelings of others.
                  Please help keep the forum vibrant by spreading the work to friends and colleagues via word of mouth or social media.
                  Thank you for contributing to this site.

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    Start getting those letters out and keep the goals in mind.
                    47 BC : Julius Cesar : Veni Vidi Vici : I came, I saw I conquered.
                    2018 AD : Modern Man : I shopped, I clicked, I collected.
                    How times change.

                    If you find you have read something that has upset or offended you an anyway please unread it at once.

                    Comment

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