MURs by trained technicians

[kemzero]

Has anyone got a protocol trained technicians could use for MURs

[Zoggite]

Yes:
1. Go to Uni for 5 years
2. Study Pharmacy
3. Pass the RPSGB registration exam
4. Do the Medway MUR accreditaion course
5. Easy, isn't it?

[Linnear]

Zoggs you are awful!

But I like you!

[Zoggite]

Zoggs you are awful!

But I like you!

Wot, even after I published your BMI of 27 on the World Wide Web?
Aaaahhh!(said in a "cooey" voice)
I like you too!

[Steve G]

Has anyone got a protocol trained technicians could use for MURs

doesn't exist and can't be done - look at the service specification in the drug tariff (though you could get away with a good pre-reg doing them - I did).

More to the point, why would you have technicians doing MURs? How many techs would connect the threads of some on statins complaining of muscle pain, or a woman on the COC who tells you they are taking ibuprofen for headaches?

Even more to the point, I really enjoy doing MURs (though not the pile of scripts to check when I finish). It's not something I would want to delegate, or feel happy delegating.

[kemzero]

Yes:
1. Go to Uni for 5 years
2. Study Pharmacy
3. Pass the RPSGB registration exam
4. Do the Medway MUR accreditaion course
5. Easy, isn't it?

Hi Zoggite

Don't you think that's a bit harsh, as they will not be signing the MURs off, quite a few techs in PCTs do medication reviews etc , some are actually completing post graduate Medicines Management courses
I am aware the service spec does not include tech but neither does the service spec for dispensing .
Certainly a techs' pharmaceutical knowledge may not be on parr with a p'cists' but they should be able to support at any level

[ramroum]

doesn't exist and can't be done - look at the service specification in the drug tariff (though you could get away with a good pre-reg doing them - I did).

More to the point, why would you have technicians doing MURs? How many techs would connect the threads of some on statins complaining of muscle pain, or a woman on the COC who tells you they are taking ibuprofen for headaches?

Even more to the point, I really enjoy doing MURs (though not the pile of scripts to check when I finish). It's not something I would want to delegate, or feel happy delegating.

Sorry, but what is COC please?

[kemzero]

Sorry, but what is COC please?

Combined Oral Contraceptives??
Maybe we should ban the use of Acromyns on this forum they can be somewhat confusing..what say you all?

[Jeff]

Combined Oral Contraceptives??
Maybe we should ban the use of Acromyns on this forum they can be somewhat confusing..what say you all?

We need to be able to use them whem communicating with others so we may as well get used to them. We can always ask about the ones we don't understand..

Jeff

[Steve G]

Hi Zoggite

Don't you think that's a bit harsh, as they will not be signing the MURs off, quite a few techs in PCTs do medication reviews etc , some are actually completing post graduate Medicines Management courses
I am aware the service spec does not include tech but neither does the service spec for dispensing .
Certainly a techs' pharmaceutical knowledge may not be on parr with a p'cists' but they should be able to support at any level

Techs should be able to support pharmacists doing MURs - I have no problem with them selling the service to patients and filling in some of the paperwork beforehand. In fact I know a great way a tech could support me doing MURs - be a checking tech so I don't have to worry about the pile of scripts from the surgery.

And seriously, if MURs were delegated to techs, do you think the govt. would pay £25 per MUR? I doubt it. It's also difficult enough to get GPs on side as it is. It would be almost impossible if it was techs doing them.

I am quite happy to delegate technical tasks where possible, but not cognitive services. We need to be comfortable with MURs before we can move on to prescribing. Delegating to techs wont help at all.

[kemzero]

Techs should be able to support pharmacists doing MURs - I have no problem with them selling the service to patients and filling in some of the paperwork beforehand. In fact I know a great way a tech could support me doing MURs - be a checking tech so I don't have to worry about the pile of scripts from the surgery.

And seriously, if MURs were delegated to techs, do you think the govt. would pay £25 per MUR? I doubt it. It's also difficult enough to get GPs on side as it is. It would be almost impossible if it was techs doing them.

I am quite happy to delegate technical tasks where possible, but not cognitive services. We need to be comfortable with MURs before we can move on to prescribing. Delegating to techs wont help at all.

Point taken! I guess its all about maintaining bounderies , a tech with a clinical pharmacy post graduate qualification should be able to do MURs , as MURs are not even supposed to be clinical. In my opinion the pharmacist MUST sign it off though. Less qualified people currently provide stop smoking advice/treatment . Its all in the mix....I mean about skill mix !

[ramroum]

Combined Oral Contraceptives??
Maybe we should ban the use of Acromyns on this forum they can be somewhat confusing..what say you all?

Dear Kem,

Thank you. It is good to keep the abbreviations but with an explanation about what they are to learn from it.

[Zoggite]

Techs should be able to support pharmacists doing MURs - I have no problem with them selling the service to patients and filling in some of the paperwork beforehand. In fact I know a great way a tech could support me doing MURs - be a checking tech so I don't have to worry about the pile of scripts from the surgery.

And seriously, if MURs were delegated to techs, do you think the govt. would pay £25 per MUR? I doubt it. It's also difficult enough to get GPs on side as it is. It would be almost impossible if it was techs doing them.

I am quite happy to delegate technical tasks where possible, but not cognitive services. Delegating to techs wont help at all.

Steve,
you echo my views perfectly.
Besides, how can you "sign off" a Medicines Use Review? (no acronyms, remember?!)A significant part of the benefits of such reviews is to communicate with the patient, listen to them and respond to their worries/queries, and to get them to take ownership of their medication regime, thus increasing concordance; we'll miss that target completely if we just delegate the "one-to-one" bit and let our only involvement in the whole review be a byro-stain on the bottom of a form...

We need to be comfortable with MURs before we can move on to prescribing.

I still maintain that I have been "prescribing" since the first day that I qualified; just because I don't use green bits of paper and I restrict myself to medicines that don't have a little square that says "POM" (or Prescription-Only Medicine), doesn't mean it's not prescribing?!?

[Steve G]

Ok then, prescribing at NHS expense, including POMs.

[Linnear]

Ok then, prescribing at NHS expense, including POMs.

Shouldn't that be National Health Service not NHS?