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How to get involved in GP pharmacist training pathway as a community pharmacist?

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  • How to get involved in GP pharmacist training pathway as a community pharmacist?

    Hi everyone,


    I am a community pharmacist working for a big chain in UK but I am looking to change sector to qualify as IP and work as a clinical pharmacist in GP practices.

    I have been doing lots of reading and researching, trying to find more information regarding how to get involved in GP pharmacist training pathway, but it seems like one cannot simply apply without a surgery backing you up? I read something on CPPE like the employing bid site or surgery will have to complete a proof of appointment declaration before I can register to get involved. So my question is: as a community pharmacist not employed by a surgery is there a way to get into the pilot scheme? I am a bit lost in the overwhelming information on the CPPE website and hopefully someone can point me in the right direction. Thanks in advance.

  • #2
    Hi,

    I was exactly in the same position as you in 2016, working for a pharmacy chain, 'black horse' and then I found a job on the NHS website based in my area for the position of clinical pharmacist. You had to be trained as a pharmacist for 2 years only. That was the only criteria and it didn't matter from which sector you came from.

    If I were you, I would check the NHS jobs website daily as there are always new opportunities.

    I was part of the first wave when I initially applied for the position. There are more waves coming, so be pro-active and look on NHS jobs regularly.

    https://www.england.nhs.uk/gp/gpfv/w...rkforce/cp-gp/ This website shows when the next waves will be coming. CPPE are directly involved in training only. Surgery isn't always involved, I went through an independent company who did all the leg work and got the surgeries in my area on side and involved in the pilot. Once I applied for the position I met with the company and they told me how this all worked. They dealt with my pay and HR. Surgery is my workplace. CPPE is my trainer.

    PM if you want more information. Hope this helps

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by StraightOuttaDispensary View Post
      Hi,

      I was exactly in the same position as you in 2016, working for a pharmacy chain, 'black horse' and then I found a job on the NHS website based in my area for the position of clinical pharmacist. You had to be trained as a pharmacist for 2 years only. That was the only criteria and it didn't matter from which sector you came from.

      If I were you, I would check the NHS jobs website daily as there are always new opportunities.

      I was part of the first wave when I initially applied for the position. There are more waves coming, so be pro-active and look on NHS jobs regularly.

      https://www.england.nhs.uk/gp/gpfv/w...rkforce/cp-gp/ This website shows when the next waves will be coming. CPPE are directly involved in training only. Surgery isn't always involved, I went through an independent company who did all the leg work and got the surgeries in my area on side and involved in the pilot. Once I applied for the position I met with the company and they told me how this all worked. They dealt with my pay and HR. Surgery is my workplace. CPPE is my trainer.

      PM if you want more information. Hope this helps
      Hi thanks for the help!

      I had a look on NHS jobs website and the only one that I can find for my area is this https://www.jobs.nhs.uk/xi/vacancy/5..._ref=915150281
      Is this the sort of advertisement I should be looking at please? It looks like they are looking for an experienced clinical pharmacist rather than someone who is trying to change sector. On your link the next deadline is 20 July so they should be still advertising somewhere right if the link above is not the one?

      So basically to get started I need to get employed by a surgery first. Is that true?

      Comment


      • StraightOuttaDispensary
        Editing a comment
        The job that you have posted the link for says 'experienced' and of course you will have clinical experience so I would say you would be eligible. The post looks like its for a junior position which is the post I also ended up applying for back in 2016. At the time I had no experience working in GP practice.

        Would be a good idea for you to contact the Senior CP and discuss with her as she will be familiar with your community background and your experiences. In my experience a lot of the positions in GP practice have been taken by disillusioned community pharmacists who were unhappy with working conditions. This was certainly true when we were networking during CPPE training sessions.

        I would say this is exactly the type of advert you need to be looking at.

        "So basically to get started I need to get employed by a surgery first. Is that true?" - Yes and No. Some surgeries will do the leg work themselves and advertise a position and then put you on the CPPE pilot pathway and others will get healthcare companies often GP federations like 'Prescribing Support Services' to do the leg work and sort all the contracts, adverts, interviewing and HR stuff. So on occasion, companies like PSS will advertise on NHS jobs for clinical pharmacists in particular areas. Does that make sense??

      • mokmatthew
        mokmatthew commented
        Editing a comment
        Cool so that depends on surgery. I have emailed the job advert contact regarding my situation hopefully I can get a reply soon.

        My originally plan is to quit my current full time job with the big chain and go locuming for a bit so I can have more time to do an IP course which I plan to pay for it myself. The struggle is finding a DMP who is willing to mentor me and usually without a DMP the uni won't even let you apply for the course! I've emailed the local ccg to see if they have got a list of GP who is happy to take on the DMP role but haven't heard back from them yet.

        Any thoughts on this alternative route comparing to applying on nhs jobs -> CPPE pilot pathway?
        Thanks again.

    • #4
      Matthew, do you live anywhere near Hull? We have two vacancies for pharmacists who wish to join the scheme.
      Lively debate is encouraged but please respect the opinions and feelings of others.
      Please help keep the forum vibrant by spreading the work to friends and colleagues via word of mouth or social media.
      Thank you for contributing to this site.

      Comment


      • #5
        Look on this forum...pretty sure there was a GP offering to be a DMP for free. Alternatively some GPs will be a DMP for a fee... don't know whether you would be interested by that.

        IP course isn't that expensive so that's a bonus. I have to admit, I think you'll find it difficult if you haven't already got a job with a surgery as finding a DMP willing to give the support will be hard. If you're already in a surgery as an employee, you will have built a relationship with the GPs and that's when it becomes abit easier. Also the added incentive for the GPs is that you'll sign a lot of the prescriptions and take over some work load, so its win-win situation for them. Whereas if you're not an employee they will probably want some added incentive like a fee...

        Also be on the lookout for another pilot scheme that will be running at some point.... 'Integrated Urgent Care Pharmacists' who work in walk in centres and out of hours as medicines experts and clinicians. In this job they will train you up for the IP plus also other training like minor ailments, clinical decision making modules etc. A lot of the job is telephone triage and assessment.
        NHS England has opened its eyes and trialled this around the country and realised pharmacists are an underutilised resource who can manage things before they need to be escalated to a doctor.

        Comment


        • #6
          Originally posted by admin View Post
          Matthew, do you live anywhere near Hull? We have two vacancies for pharmacists who wish to join the scheme.
          I'm based in Bristol pretty far away from Hull I'm afraid. Any chances that you know someone in Bristol who offer opportunities too? Thanks

          Comment


          • #7
            Originally posted by StraightOuttaDispensary View Post
            Look on this forum...pretty sure there was a GP offering to be a DMP for free. Alternatively some GPs will be a DMP for a fee... don't know whether you would be interested by that.

            IP course isn't that expensive so that's a bonus. I have to admit, I think you'll find it difficult if you haven't already got a job with a surgery as finding a DMP willing to give the support will be hard. If you're already in a surgery as an employee, you will have built a relationship with the GPs and that's when it becomes abit easier. Also the added incentive for the GPs is that you'll sign a lot of the prescriptions and take over some work load, so its win-win situation for them. Whereas if you're not an employee they will probably want some added incentive like a fee...

            Also be on the lookout for another pilot scheme that will be running at some point.... 'Integrated Urgent Care Pharmacists' who work in walk in centres and out of hours as medicines experts and clinicians. In this job they will train you up for the IP plus also other training like minor ailments, clinical decision making modules etc. A lot of the job is telephone triage and assessment.
            NHS England has opened its eyes and trialled this around the country and realised pharmacists are an underutilised resource who can manage things before they need to be escalated to a doctor.
            Thanks will have a look into those!

            Comment


            • #8
              If you’re in Bristol, try looking across the border into wales. They do things a bit differently there and having an IP is not essential. Look on the NHS wales website for opportunities, they do come up from time to time. Try and get some welsh Locums so you can get an understanding of the slight differences between England and Wales in community pharmacy.

              Comment


              • mokmatthew
                mokmatthew commented
                Editing a comment
                Good shout! Will look into that too thanks

              • admin
                admin commented
                Editing a comment
                No sorry I don’t know anybody in Bristol.

            • #9
              Morning guys just another question -

              So to be an IP one requirement is to
              • have identified an area of clinical practice in which to develop their prescribing skills and have up-to-date clinical, pharmacological and pharmaceutical knowledge relevant to their intended area of prescribing practice
              I have been trying to find a full list of areas that are available to choose from. I know I can go for the more common ones e.g. diabetes, hypertension/cardiovascular, sexual health, asthma/copd etc. but there are other areas that I am more interested in like dermatology or microbiology. Anyone can possibly shed some lights on what other areas are available to choose from please?

              Comment


              • #10
                You can literally choose any area of prescribing, but it will need to be fairly focussed and you need to be able to evidence it. It should be something you deal with quite commonly so you can have a reasonable amount of practice prescribing and have relevant consultations that can be observed by your DMP. The wider the scope, the more work you will have to do to demonstrate your knowledge of the drugs, s/e, c/i, monitoring etc . For example I chose asthma, then limited this to adults only, and also to the then BTS 2014 steps 1-4. Hospital colleague did prescribing for treatment of neuro TB, but struggled to find cases so widened it do include more TB types. Another hospital colleague did prescribing IV bisphosphonates so very specific, I was working in primary care so had plenty of people to see. If you did microbiology you would need to specify what conditions you would be treating eg UTI or URTI or whatever and be able to evidence that you have the clinical examination skills to assess and diagnose the patient appropriately.

                Comment


                • #11
                  In retail I operated a needle exchange scheme and advised addicts when dispensing methadone and supervising dosing. So some experience there. If you conduct NMS and MURs you already have clinical experience and dealing with the public in a private consulting situation. One large multiple supplies name badges with "Consultant Pharmacist"..
                  So, retail does give much of the experience you need.
                  If still practising, I would go for addiction services and also minor problems in surgeries plus management of repeat medication. This would reduce a GP's work load. Perusing PACT figures monthly would enable you to give advice on prescribing.
                  Do not underestimate yourself.
                  johnep.

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    I wouldn’t focus too much on the clinical area. One of the ideas of the course is to provide you with the tools to become competent in ANY area after you pass. It may be an idea to try something simple at first for the purposes of the course. As an IP, you can prescribe any item from your area of competence. You can quite easily look at other areas once you have the basic IP under your belt.

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      This is an area I am interested in, although I have been in my new job as a pharmacist manager for just 6 months I am starting to get a bit bored and need a new challenge.

                      I did get in contact with my old university a few months back and they said you need to find a DMP by yourself and already have knowledge in the area you want to practice in to get on the prescriber course. So then I was thinking perhaps it would be prudent to do a clinical diploma first to build that expertise in my field (also I don't know any Drs). The NHS seems to be pushing hard now to integrate us into surgeries so I don't want to miss a good opportunity but where does one start? I looked on the list of surgeries and there aren't any in my area. Not sure whether the list is for surgeries that are taking part and have already filled their positions or are looking for people... Where do they advertise these jobs? (I don't see anything on nhs jobs), perhaps I should email a few of them and see if they can give me some information.

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        We have had adverts on the NHS job site. We have had three applicants for two jobs.
                        Lively debate is encouraged but please respect the opinions and feelings of others.
                        Please help keep the forum vibrant by spreading the work to friends and colleagues via word of mouth or social media.
                        Thank you for contributing to this site.

                        Comment


                        • #15
                          Originally posted by admin View Post
                          We have had adverts on the NHS job site. We have had three applicants for two jobs.
                          Under what title did you advertise the position? I looked on the NHS site for my area and couldn't find anything related to pharmacists outside of hospital.

                          I thought I would chance it and sent an email to a GP group asking how they recruited their pharmacists, hopefully they will reply with some information (they seem to have about 20 practices in their group). There doesn't seem to be a lot of information or consistency on how to find the positions if you are a pharmacist, just if you are a practice wanting to apply for funding. Maybe the key is to phone/email every surgery and ask them if they have enrolled or are looking to.

                          The list of sites taking part (https://www.england.nhs.uk/publicati...e-pilot-sites/) seems a bit outdated, the spreadsheet only goes up to wave 3 but they should be on wave 6 now. Some of the group's names on that spreadsheet don't really tell me where they are so it's difficult to track down contact details. There is one that is local but when you google their name, nothing comes back.

                          Admin, would I be correct in assuming your organisation offered the DMP to the pharmacists, getting on the IP course is not too difficult as long as you have a DMP behind you, did you look for any clinical qualifications beyond being a standard pharmacist? I have just hit my two year mark for being qualified so I don't have any further qualifications yet. I cannot decide if it is more sensible to do a clinical diploma first or just try and get straight onto this and hopefully get training on the job, I don't want to miss the proverbial boat.

                          Comment


                          • mokmatthew
                            mokmatthew commented
                            Editing a comment
                            I've found a job on nhs jobs website. The job adverts would normally be titled "General Practice Pharmacist", "Pharmacist" or "Clinical Pharmacist" so if I were you I would create multiple search notifications with these key words. They are likely to be advertised by "Central Advertising - General Practitioners".

                            Good luck with your job hunting!
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