Every pharmacist should have prescribing rights!

[vanquish s]

Well ours is, obviously a seperate system would have to be established i.e. one pharmacist prescribes while another dispenses, if profitable enough im shore multiples would fund it. Or just run private clinics

[Studentpharmacist]

What would be the problem if the physicians wrote diagnoses and we filled per our prescribing rights the medicine? That would cut out on all the time spent in clarifications on the correct medication, the dosage changes, the potential medication errors through second and possibly third hand communication. What if some day prescibing/dispensing became one and physicians had more time to do what they specialize in which is diagnosing and we as pharmacists were able to utilize our four year+ education to the fullest extent? Would it not be safer for the patient? There is a lot of time spent calling the doctor's office...

[johnep]

Sounds as if you are from USA. Unfortunately, prescribing is what Drs insist is their right and jealously guarded. Here in UK, however, we do have pharmacist prescribers. They take an intensive course. Nurse prescribers already well established.
johnep

[Studentpharmacist]

Thanks Johnep for responding. Is there data to show how pharmacist prescribing in your country have been economically beneficial? There is some legislature this year to be looked at in Indiana re prescribing rights -- only in certain settings -- but it is a start. My thinking is that if it looks like an economical benefit, it will go a long way.

I was looking at a 2006 article from the UK and it seemed that your medical association had some issues with pharmacists prescribing as well -- the Canadian medical association as well currently I believe. So I am thinking that it is difficult for physicians to move over no matter where they practice. It just take time.

Since we as pharmacists in the US do have quite extensive training as PharmDs, I am wondering what extensive training you had to go through in order to prescribe. Could you tell me a little regarding that?

Thank you very much for your time. I really do appreciate it. Hopefully the pharmacists in the US soon will join you in the UK as having prescribing rights.

Kim

[bleepholder]

if we want prescribing rights, wouldn't it make sense to go and do medicine?? surely we kind of prescribe and diagnose when we sell OTC products..we diagnose based on what customers tell us, then we sell them a product, ok so its not strictly us prescribing the product, but still......

Sounds all well and good, doctors writing out a diagnosis and us supplying the drugs, but i don't think we have enough training to do this....i wouldn't feel comfrotable supplying drugs against a diagnosis....i don't know all possible disease states and their management (taking into account the patients/customers other disease states) nothing is ever straight forward.....maybe if we were taught more at uni, in similar ways to medics, then its something we could do!

its good that people want pharmacists to do as much as possible, but can we really be expected to be making a diagnosis, recommending appropriate products, doing MURs, other training CPD stuff....soon we'll be a jack of all trades, master of none!

[Studentpharmacist]

As a PharmD we do study many disease states and the medications related to those disease states. The diagnosis is made by the MD not the pharmacist. The pt would bring in the diagnosis. The pharmacist does have a medical history with all the different disease states the pt has. The pharmacist would have access to the current lab values via the computer. The information would all be there in order for there to be an informed decision. There may be further required training involved. But as it stands, many physicians when they graduate and are general practioners have only a semesters worth of pharmacology compared to the four years of pharmacology that a pharmacist has. It would seem to me as far as how medications interact inside the body as regards kinetics, the pharmacist would know more than the newly graduated physician. And what would it be that I am a master of....dispensing as many vials as I can?? Computers can do that better than I ever could??? Checking to make sure the MD has got it right??? I guess I want more than proofing another profession. I want to know how the medication works inside the body. I want to know about disease states. I want to be a master of MEDICINE. That does set me apart from being a physician. Because they are masters of DIAGNOSIS. If we work together, we can help more people and make less mistakes through direct communication. That is at least what I believe and hope for our profession.

[Studentpharmacist]

I also wanted to add. It depends on the pharmacist's education level and desire. Not all pharmacists have the same education level. In the US all pharmacists are required now to have a four year PharmD degree where we do have a lot of the training and beyond what a medic has, I believe --- yet we do not as yet have prescribing rights. This makes no sense. To have so much education and not use it is wrong in my opinion. That is where I am coming from. So when you mentioned "maybe if we were taught more at uni", I believe that in the US we are. And how would it feel to be taught that and not to use it? So that is what I hope will change. I realized in my last post that perhaps I was missing the point that I was not talking to a US citizen -- or if I was, that perhaps I was talking to one before it was mandated that a PharmD was required.

[bleepholder]

yeah maybe in the US it is possible....as for UK we are not as educated with regards to diagnosis and prescribing. don't get me wrong we too study pharmacology but maybe not in advance as yourself. I can't really quantify as i don't know what exactly the PharmD entails...

Maybe, just maybe there si hope for us all and we can move away from proofing other professions and expand our industry?!?

[Studentpharmacist]

I thought that you did have prescribing rights in the UK but had to go through extra training. That is at least what I have read. Full prescribing rights at that -- only usually limited to the area of expertise as usually is the case with physicians as well. So, the UK is actually further along than the US which does bring me hope. And yes, I sure hope we can move away from proofing other professions. I am going to give a lot of my effort towards that end by becoming a chair in our AphA-ASP organization as regards the more political nature of things. Thanks for responding.

[bleepholder]

in UK you can have prescribing rights, per se, if you do a prescribing course, there are 2 different types...supplementary prescriber, where you have a joint care with a physcian and there is independent prescribing where you look after a patient. The idea is that you choose an area of ailments to concentrate on and thus specialise in. I personally don't know of many pharmacists who are idnependent prescribers...for me its just another hoop to jump through, and something i'm not going to pursue, certainly not in the coming months...maybe over time i will change my outlook.

at the moment, i'm happy sitting on a hospital ward telling doctors what to change their prescriptions to....