Refusing EHC Supply

[gaby]

i dont think it's pharms involved with euthanasia, other than providing injections i guess...

Well i have read about the man who went abroad for euthanasia, he understood his condition and how it would get worser progressively, each of his senses shutting down one at a time (maybe paper hype). But he understood what was to come and said when the time came that he couldnt communicate he wished to die as he didnt want to be a burden upon anyone else and wanted to die with dignity.

In his situation even i would want someone to mercifully grant me death.

and on the note of judging, im sure the professionals in countries where euthanasia is legal have guidelines etc and have been trained in that area.

Also i think the death wish should only be the patients not of carers or representatives.

But on that same topic, what about hospitals that turn off life support??? esp. the baby case, is that not similar if not the same as euthanasia??? merci-killing. or allowing one to die.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4770154.stm

[Jeff]

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

I do my bit by working with animal rights organisations

Even that's not without its dilemmas - I left animal rights when they wanted to insist on pre-stunning at the local abbatoirs. It put animal rights at loggerheads with some religious groups and their requirements.
I suppose it would really upset the RPSGB if I made any mention of rescuing/stealing (deleat as your morals allow) smoking beagles from ICI.

Jeff

[Universal Angel]

Originally Posted by Jeff

Even that's not without its dilemmas - I left animal rights when they wanted to insist on pre-stunning at the local abbatoirs. It put animal rights at loggerheads with some religious groups and their requirements.
I suppose it would really upset the RPSGB if I made any mention of rescuing/stealing (deleat as your morals allow) smoking beagles from ICI.

Jeff

Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater! We can't achieve perfect justice until the Afterlife begins, but one must do what one can. Think of everything campaign groups have achieved. Intentions are everything, stealing beagles would wake sleep-walkers into facing up to the injustices they sanction, so you have my blessing to steal, if not the RPSGBs!
I wouldn't sanction anyone who stole as an alternative to earning a fair living through hard work, but we must consider that stealing is justified in order to bring the extreme distress and injustices of the beagles, to the attention of everyone who has chosen a position that comes with the responsibilities of authority,power, caring, and influence. After all, it would be like taking a penny out of the Queen's purse, not like stealing a normal persons hard-earned life-savings....

Thinking of which, the Queen is a disgrace to the country, she was recently pictured wringing a bird's neck which had been shot down during a royal hunting session. Mindless cruelty, she can't possess a spiritual bone in her body...
Anyone fancy forming a pressure group to redefine the kind of "royalty" representing pharmacists through the RPSGB? I would insert the appropriate jokey face here, but they seem to have disappeared. Any ideas, admin????

[Steve G]

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

If all the pharmacists in a local area opted out of EHC, a half-drunk couple would think twice before a quick one, and more couples would have to take responsibility for what they started, rather than perverting the nature of sex. Perversion, even behind closed doors, leads to negative repercussions for everyone when the perpetrators come out into society....

The problem with being half drunk is that your thought processes don't really work as well as they should. I doubt the non-availability of EHC OTC would have any effect on the number of half-drunk couples having a quicke.

What exactly do you mean by 'perverting the nature of sex'?

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

You say "if you feel so strongly about animal welfare" as though that's a strange thing. A quote from American author Alice Walker; "The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans any more than black people were made for white, or women created for men".
Not so long ago, racism was legalised in many parts of the world. I want speciesism abolished, because Speciesism Sucks. So no, I don't go crazy thinking of evil perpetrators, I'm at the other end of the spectrum, and am completely sane. I do my bit by working with animal rights organisations such as PETA, campaigning in my spare time.

Words fail me here. The comparison of 'speciesism' (is that even a word?) with racism is completely spurious and very offensive. In order for there to be
rights there must also be responsibilites. How exactly do you propose for animals to fulfil their responsibilities?

[Jeff]

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

"The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans

Times have changed

http://www.allerca.com/

Jeff

[Universal Angel]

Originally Posted by Steve G

Words fail me here. The comparison of 'speciesism' (is that even a word?) with racism is completely spurious and very offensive. In order for there to be
rights there must also be responsibilites. How exactly do you propose for animals to fulfil their responsibilities?

It's a word used by PETA, and all words started somewhere at some time.

Do you propose to take rights away from babies and children, alzheimers patients, disabled and learning difficulties people, and permanent income support and benefits claimers who are perfectly capable of work then?

Typical colonialist mentality, see sheep blissfully grazing in the sun, go capture and exploit them. The sheep owe you as much responsibilities as Aborigines and Red Indians owed to violent, greedy, arrogant thugs. Give them a portion of land and leave them be, they don't owe humans anything whatsoever, never mind responsibilities.
A civilized society should operate through fair co-operation, if the animals don't ask anything of humans, then they are not obliged to give humans any responsibilities.
The only animals we should be allowed to kill are those which would attack humans, this policy would lead to a world of peaceful herbivores, Utopia would be so easy to achieve if everyone stopped voting all the power to greedy twisted devils.

[Universal Angel]

Originally Posted by Jeff

Times have changed

http://www.allerca.com/

Jeff

Would you like to be kept as a pet, eg.) as the only human in a gorilla enclosure?

Times changed when Settlers enslaved Africans, you know that didn't make it right. I hope.

Fools follow blindly, wise people set examples....

[Steve G]

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

Do you propose to take rights away from babies and children, alzheimers patients, disabled and learning difficulties people, and permanent income support and benefits claimers who are perfectly capable of work then?

Where on earth did that come from?

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

A civilized society should operate through fair co-operation, if the animals don't ask anything of humans, then they are not obliged to give humans any responsibilities.

But how many animals are alive only because they are fed and looked after by humans?

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

The only animals we should be allowed to kill are those which would attack humans, this policy would lead to a world of peaceful herbivores, Utopia would be so easy to achieve if everyone stopped voting all the power to greedy twisted devils.

So carnivores and omnivores aren't worthy of living? You'd want to slaughter lions, tigers, dogs, bears, sharks, wolves, gorillas, chimps, stingrays, snakes and numerous other animals? I also doubt this world would last very long. With no predation, the population of herbivores would boom and would consume all vegetation, which would increase CO2 levels and accelerate global warming. And thats without taking into account the extra methane production. But then I guess it would be a bit difficult to teach cows about sustainable development.

[Jeff]

Originally Posted by Universal Angel

Would you like to be kept as a pet?

It could have it's good points - being put out to stud :-)
The beagle mentioned earlier lived out its life as a pet.

Times changed when Settlers enslaved Africans, you know that didn't make it right. I hope.

Back to philosophy ;-)
Is "right" unchanging or is it related to the times and the situation.
Is economic exploitation so very different.
Is a free South Africa better than the old? (For my view search ther PJ onlinefor a letter from me)

Jeff

[Universal Angel]

Originally Posted by Steve G

Where on earth did that come from?




But how many animals are alive only because they are fed and looked after by humans?



So carnivores and omnivores aren't worthy of living? You'd want to slaughter lions, tigers, dogs, bears, sharks, wolves, gorillas, chimps, stingrays, snakes and numerous other animals? I also doubt this world would last very long. With no predation, the population of herbivores would boom and would consume all vegetation, which would increase CO2 levels and accelerate global warming. And thats without taking into account the extra methane production. But then I guess it would be a bit difficult to teach cows about sustainable development.

That came from you saying animals can be exploited on the basis of them not taking on responsibilities.
We only see so many herbivores around because humans have been breeding them for so long, Left on their own, they'd do a better job of self-maintaining balance than overbreeding humans. Did you know that it takes much more land to breed cattle for burgers than to grow crops for the same number of humans? World hunger could be eradicated if we all became vegan, check out www.vegansociety.com
Lots of nicer animals have come to extinction, if the above animals refuse to stop killing weaker animals, I'll be glad to never see them again.
Very wise quote I once came across; "You can judge how advanced and civilised a society is from how it treats it's weaker members".
As humans we are caretakers of animals, the lion can only lay with the lamb if it doesn't fancy it for lunch.
There is a parallel relationship between animal exploitation and cruelty, and unfairness and cruelty to fellow humans. We will never be exempt from repercussions until we eradicate ALL nastiness.